Following on from the Monks, pastors, webmasters, cultivators etc discussion Steve has written a few of his thoughts about the place of the paid worker in the Em Church.

Here are a few quotes…

If I follow the idea’s that you are suggesting and develop an organic, movement of small responsive missional groups, what do I do for a living?”

As far as my research goes, the first “full time” workers were the apostolic and evangelistic types. You were paid to start new communities, not to maintain them

This gutsy young guy fronted up with the issue. Many people train for their whole lives and consequently gain a series of skills that are virtually useless in any other vocational context. There is a vested interest in maintaining the status quo for a very good reason. Bills need to be paid.

So… the bottom line (so to speak) is that there is no money to be made in the Em Missional Church…

And yet we need to live…

And some of us are called to be missionaries…

So how do we earn the necessary dollars?…

My two bobs worth is that we sometimes need to free people up to do this work. It doesn’t just happen – there is stuff that goes on behind the scenes, particularly in the realm of thinking and dreaming (something that is often underestimated) which means we need to support them.

I find that just teaching on Thursday and Friday seems to cut a swathe thru my week and limits what I can do. It hits me hard to lose those two days … but maybe that is because I have 3 paid roles…

On the other hand I like a stock standard day job, because it reminds me how others feel when they get home from work – tired and maybe not that fired up for a small group meeting or a missional activity.

If someone wanted to throw me another $22K a year I’d quit teaching tomorrow – because I don’t enjoy it. The big issue though would be the sense of identity that goes with work. I have felt that maybe our community would find it hard to grasp this guy who seems to have time on his hands to float around, have coffee, help with patios, go fishing, chat in the street etc.

My heart is in finding ways of connecting in with the community around here and yet it seems I need to do other things to subsidise that.

I have said before that I’m sure Paul didn’t wake up each morning and think ‘you beauty another tent!!’ But he did what he had to do so he could do what he loved to do. If teaching primary kids is my sacrifice then I’ll do it to have time to do the rest of the stuff.

Justin is asking whether there is a place for a paid pastor in the church. Part of his post reflects back on my own post and says the following:

“Today, Hamo got me thinking with his announcement that he’s been asked to do a blessing service for a neighbor’s son, as he did for his own son a few weeks ago. I was talking with my wife about this, as we are vocational church planters and do not really consider ourselves “pastors” in the proper sense (we’re more into the “priesthood of all believers” thing).

This is a tough one, though. Hamo got asked to do this because people see him in some regards as a pastor. I don’t think people will ever see any of our church planting team as pastors as such. Is this a problem? Maybe. Maybe we don’t need to be pastors. Maybe we need to be monks”

Read on here…

For my money, I agree totally with Justin that the priesthood of all believers is a key theological tenet we want to adhere to, but I don’t see that it has to preclude some folks from being freed up to spend more time in a leadership role.

My take on scripture is that both paid workers and ‘priesthood of all’ co-exist and maybe we need to find ways to make it happen again…

Monks?… hmmm… I like the ideas Justin articulates, but the monk notion just doesn’t fire me up! It still feels too separatist.

I have a suggestion to put to our team at our next Focus meeting. I’d like all of us to consider practicing the discipline of reflective learning over the next month with a particular focus on how we are engaging in mission.

Here is the daily task sheet – what do you reckon?

Mission Reflections

Complete for each day in the next month. This might only take 5 minutes a day, but it may take longer if you want to give it more time.

It is intended as a discipline

to help reflect on how God is at work in you and in the community we are a part of.

We will share what we have discovered when we gather in 4 weeks time.

1. Where did I see God at work around me today?

2. Where did I share something of my faith with someone today – how did that happen and what did I do?

3. What feelings arose in me as I engaged with people today?

4. What am I learning about God / Jesus / mission / myself?

5. Are there intersections between my current experience in the scriptures and what happened today?

Summary: Before coming to the group take some time to look back and summarise what themes emerge in your journal.

I am hopeful that as we complete this together we will see patterns and trends emerge in our lives and community and it will also bring missional practice to our consciousness. In a sense I am hoping it will train us to be more effective missionaries as we do/reflect/do/reflect etc.

Its not rocket science, but sometimes it takes a disciplined practice to help us move from old patterns to new ways.

Do you reckon people will do it?

I have heard this a few times lately.

Its a statement I struggle with because it:

a) implies Christians are ‘nice’ – some are 🙂
b) people who aren’t Christians might be ‘nice’, but its not to be expected

When you take that point of view into the world with you its going to show in relationships.

Actually if I were more blunt find it offensive – there are a hell of a lot of pagans out there who are great people.

Why do we sometimes assume that if a person shows love and kindness he/she is potentially a Christian and not just another reflection of ‘the image?’…

Anyway – rant over…

One thing I always feel when I work hard and get busy is that I run the risk of getting behind on my ‘think time’.

When life is ambling along at a steady pace I am able to create lots of space for thought and reflection – when it speeds up I find myself thinking and reflecting less and simply doing more.

Its a dangerous place to be as if I don’t stop and reflect on what I am doing its easy to get caught up with just go go go.

Right now I’m in a busy patch and that’s ok, (it will end) but one thing this blog can do for me in this period is help me to keep reflecting on life and where we are at.

One of today’s sermon illustrations…

“Let me ask – in the last week how many of you seriously pondered whether you would head off a nudist colony this weekend?

Hmmm… not many!

But” If that nudist colony had better volleyball courts, a bigger swimming pool, better food and great coffee would you then go?

Still not convinced hey?!

Makes sense – because you wouldn’t belong there – you would feel dreadfully uncomfortable there – it isn’t your thing – the values and practices of the nudists would make you feel like a fish out of water. And everything being offered there you can get somewhere else without feeling uncomfortable.

Perhaps that is some of what it is like for people outside the church?…

I mean I have never even considered going to a nudist colony – do we really think our churches ever go thru the heads of people who are not Christians?…”

(BTW – what is it with nudists and volleyball? Seems like one sport I wouldn’t want to play naked!)

Two quotes from Martin Robinson’s latest book ‘Invading Secular Space’

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“What would it look like for a church to function in such a way that the primary goal of church life was not to attract more people into attendance and membership, but to produce people who had a profound sense of their personal relationship to God, their resource in Christ and could take that reality into the world with them” p.111.

“In this system the sacred represents a refuge from the secular, as compared to a resource with which to inhabit the secular.” P.111

I’ll be speaking about this on the weekend…

Now that the first Forge intensive is over people are asking me was it a ‘success’? Or was I happy with how it went?

The short answer… yes.

In terms of a valuable learning experience and life shaping encounter, for many of those present I’d say it was definitely those things. For some I’d say it was very stimulating, but maybe ‘not their bag’. I’m not sure anyone would have considered it a waste of time.

The word that comes to mind to sum up what I saw people feeling is ‘disturbance’. I know several people who were disturbed, by what they heard and its implications for their life and ministry. Someone once said “you can’t unsee something once you’ve seen it”. I feel for these folks who are committed members of established churches, but disturbed at some of the undergirding philosophies that drive those churches. (Which is not to say that all is bad)

It raises the question – is it healthy for us to disturb people in that way?

If I answer that for myself I say ‘most definitely’ – I have appreciated the disturbance and wouldn’t be here today without it. Often growth and pain go hand in hand.

I’ll be praying for those who are feeling disturbed.young frankenstein dvdrip download

Ever had one of those people come to your place how is a well known / world renown communicator?

I’ve met a few over the years – some who do their thing, then ‘take the money and run’ and some who seem to be actually interested in what’s happening.

One of my fondest memories from our four day Forge intensive is of the Saturday night session. Mark Sayers spent two hours presenting his stuff and did a great job. There was no expectation that he would do anything more, but Mark helped with dishes and with clean up and my final image of that night is of the guest speaker making his way across the carpark to deposit two large green bags in the dumpster. No one asked him or expected it of him, but he did it.

Now I’m not having a go at those who do their thing, get paid and leave. However Saturday night we saw a bloke who wasn’t just a great communicator, but someone who in his own quiet way showed that he was one of us download batman gotham knight free .

Carrying the rubbish is as powerful a way of communicating as being articulate with ideas. In fact Mark’s actions probably said more to me than his words…

On Feb 21st we want to do something to mark the birth of our son Sam.

Ok – so its his first birthday (18th) and maybe a little after the event, but we wanted to wait until we were living here before we did a ‘baby dedication’ or similar.

His birthday seems like a good time. We’re hoping to have something on the front lawn with family, church friends and neighbours – a barbecue type of gig with time in there for us to ‘thank God for Sam’.

I don’t know the best term for baby dedications in a mission context (any ideas) so in the absence of better suggestions we’ll call it just that – ‘thank God for Sam!’

I’m hoping it will be a time when we can say thank you for a great little bloke, where we can commit ourselves to the job of parenting as Christians and where our family, friends and neighbours can stand with us in the task of raising our children.

What would you call this type of thing?…pink panther strikes again the divx online