Why do we sometimes feel compelled to add a few extra-biblical rules to how we see discipleship?
Scot Mcknight has a great 5 part series on ‘zealotry’, and the putting of fences around the Bible, which he suggests is every bit as unbiblical as liberalism’s dispensing with biblical truth. As usual Scot makes a lot of sense.
You can start reading here
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I remember this same debate taking place at my church when I was only 18.
The ‘rules’ were that if you wanted to be a church member you weren’t allowed to drink alcohol or smoke tobacco. I didn’t do either of those things so I didn’t make any argument.
However a few of my older friends/mentors took it right up to the super-fundy powerbrokers and went head to head on the issue.
Eventually it was removed from the requirements of membership.
I was surprised at the vehemence with which my older friends went after this issue, but with the benefit of a few more years I am now able to see the significance of it.
We all have our denominational idiosyncrasies, but I just wonder what Jesus would say to the Southern Baptist about this decision…
This comes from Simon The questions aren’t always the best, but it does challenge you to think.
You scored as Kingdom as a Christianised Society. Christians shouldn’t withdraw from the world, but by being present in it they can transform it. The kingdom is not only spiritual, but social, political, and cultural.
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One of the questions that has come up regularly in my discussions with youth pastors is the changing shape of sexual morality and male/female relationships among Christian young people.
What is the go here?
In these changing and supposedly ‘enlightened’ times is it now ok to do the hokey pokey pre-marriage? Is it now ok to hook up with and marry someone who doesn’t share your faith? Are these cultural norms or biblical ones?
I’ll confess my hand straight up on this one. I hold a conservative position. I believe the Bible leads us to a position of purity pre-marriage and then to sharing our lives with another follower of Jesus.
I believe sex (in its various forms i.e. not just intercourse) belongs in marriage. I also believe that is hard to do and our failures are always forgivable. However using that as an escape route (no pun intended) is pretty lame.
I also believe Christians are to marry people who share their faith. It is definitely not a sure fire way to have a great marriage, but honestly, I don’t think its even a real question if the driving agenda of our lives is ‘what does God want for me?’ Does God want me to spend my life with someone who is not interested in him and his kingdom? Ummm…
However, all that said, the reality is that most young people in churches today (I have heard it estimated 80% or higher) do not hold that same ‘no sex before marriage’ view. Or if they espouse it, they don’t practice it. And when it comes to finding a partner its tough for Christian young people. The field is narrow.
FWIW, its my own conviction that these are times to trust God, rather than give him the flick. My own experience of singleness almost brought me to despair as I couldn’t seem to find a suitable partner anywhere. But just as all hope was fading (I was all of 26!) Danelle popped up out of the blue.
I believe that old adage from 1 Samuel is completely true “He honours me, I will honour”. It doesn’t translate as he who tithes will have a heap of cash, or he who only dates Christian girls will marry a babe, or he who doesn’t do ‘it’ pre-marriage will get it more after. But I do believe that God doesn’t forget his kids at any time.
How about you?
What do you reckon on this increasingly controversial topic?
Is the changing position on sex a product of a changing culture or ought we read the Bible differently?
Is the idea of dating and marrying someone of the same faith an outdate one or is it something we still ought to hold to.
How much of our behaviour is actually shaped by our feelings at the time, and how much is by what we claim to believe.
Ok – all you youth pastor types! This is real life for you. These are the people you deal with every day. Lets hear your take on it.
I have an atheist friend who loves to debate religion and matters of faith. She is very sharp, always fun to debate with, and asks all the tough questions. I like her! The other night as we were chatting she asked to have a look at a Bible. Another friend brought out one from her childhood and we carried on the conversation.
She opened the Bible randomly to explore it and this was what she read. Its from the story of the golden calf:
Exo 32:27 and he said to them, “The LORD God of Israel commands you to strap on your swords and go through the camp, killing your relatives, your friends, and your neighbors.” 28 The men of the Levi tribe followed his orders, and that day they killed about three thousand men.
“What is your God on about?!!” she asks.
Fair question I’d say…
How would you respond?
Yesterday I met with ‘L’ a regular reader here and a fellow traveller on the road of rethinking mission and church.
I asked L how she was going and her reply was interesting. Recently her mum who suffers from Alzhiemers, had broken her leg, so there was a lot of time being spent visiting her and caring for her. L also has a very sick son, who has required a lot of care over the last 12 months.
L’s question was ‘are we people who live for God and his kingdom and fit our life (with all its complexities of sick family members etc) in around that, or does God and his kingdom fit in around the life we have to live?’
Its a good question I reckon.
Is God’s calling on us the primary focus of our lives, or does his calling on us fall subject to whatever is happening in the life of our family and those close to us?
As ihave reflected on it my guess is that its never a simple response but something of a messy convoluted ‘both/and’. We are always called to be dedicated to our families, but at the same time we may have a very strong sense of calling from God that guides our lives. I don’t think I’d like to come down hard on one side or another. I have seen family sacrificed on the altar of ministry but equally I have seen family deified and God’s calling minimised.
Well here we go…
I will risk an all out assault from the fundy fringe by asking the question, is the Jonah story a legitimate historical account or is it allegorical in nature, or are there other options? You are not allowed to answer with ‘does it matter?’!
We are about to explore it in our community gatherings and as much as I am loving studying the book, I am interested in this particular question.
What do you think and how do you know?…
BTW – he’s one grumpy bugger isn’t he?!download thing the austin powers in goldmember divx
Its not often I write a new sermon these days. Its easy when you preach around the to shake up a few old ones and get some fizz back in them. But it is also lazy and even I get bored with the after a while, especially when the stories aren’t current.
Today I was preaching at Katanning Baptist and the topic was ‘the power of consistent, compelling, subversive goodness’, a look at mission thru good deeds.
I think it was an average sermon, but it was nice to create something new!
“Jesus’ life and teachings particularly the Sermon on the Mount in Matthew, and the Sermon on the Plain in Luke, are normative for a follower’s lifestyle (or ethics) when empowered by the Holy Spirit. I don’t believe Jesus teaches unrealistic ideals or that Jesus teaches legalistic must do’s. Rather Jesus invites us, and the Holy Spirit empowers, to participate in God’s transformative redemptive, suffering love of the Kingdom.”
A friend has posited this as his ‘heresy’.
Is it a heresy?
Is it on the money?…download flesh and blood show the dvdrip
Today I had time to read the discussion taking place at Phil Baker’s blog on the issue of tithing.
Allan Meyer has argued his case in favour of tithing over the last few days and others have responded both agreeing and disagreeing.
You might like to check it out. Its a long read and the arguments get quite intricate in places, but it might help to show where pro-tithe folks derive their theology from.
I don’t really want to get into the debate except to the extent that it impinges on our freedom in Christ. I reckon Paul always found that worth defending.
Personally, I see the issue quite differently to Alan. I’d be ok with that as I obviously see it quite different to a lot of folks, but my concern is that in his tone I actually hear some of the worst of the ‘pro-tithe’ approach, what in places feels a bit like theological coercion of people into giving their money.